Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[The Avenger]

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

Speak for yourself, don't even put that lame idea in their head.

The data centre people got BTC, we want BTC.

We are losing BTC = compensation in BTC.

They claim on their website the Jupiter is 550GH/s machine, so at that speed, can currently mine 1.5BTC per day.

I think 1.5BTC per day late is fair compensation, (until the next difficulty change and that figure can be adjusted).

You promised delivery of ALL units by the 15th - twice (-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=309391 ) - so put your money BTC where your mouth is KNC.

[jmevz]

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

Speak for yourself, don't even put that lame idea in their head.

The data centre people got BTC, we want BTC.

We are losing BTC = compensation in BTC.

They claim on their website the Jupiter is 550GH/s machine, so at that speed, can current mine 1.5BTC per day.

I think 1.5BTC per day late is fair compensation, (until the next difficulty change and that figure can be adjusted).

You promised delivery of ALL units by the 15th - twice (-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=309391 ) - so put your money BTC where your mouth is KNC.

BTC compensation is fine with me too.

[jmevz]

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

Speak for yourself, don't even put that lame idea in their head.

The data centre people got BTC, we want BTC.

We are losing BTC = compensation in BTC.

They claim on their website the Jupiter is 550GH/s machine, so at that speed, can current mine 1.5BTC per day.

I think 1.5BTC per day late is fair compensation, (until the next difficulty change and that figure can be adjusted).

You promised delivery of ALL units by the 15th - twice (-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=309391 ) - so put your money BTC where your mouth is KNC.

BTC compensation is fine with me too.

They promised all units would be shipped, didn't they? Not delivered (received)... So we should all have tracking numbers by the 15th at least. No tracking number, then compensation...

[The Avenger]

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

Speak for yourself, don't even put that lame idea in their head.

The data centre people got BTC, we want BTC.

We are losing BTC = compensation in BTC.

They claim on their website the Jupiter is 550GH/s machine, so at that speed, can current mine 1.5BTC per day.

I think 1.5BTC per day late is fair compensation, (until the next difficulty change and that figure can be adjusted).

You promised delivery of ALL units by the 15th - twice (-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=309391 ) - so put your money BTC where your mouth is KNC.

BTC compensation is fine with me too.

It's in their best interests to do this.

Otherwise, come 15th October, the chargeback storm is gonna hit them. It could destroy their credit line. And their ability to take credit card payments may be revoked.

They need to give us an update and accept to compensate customers who are going to have their unit shipped late at 1.5BTC/day (recalculated at next difficulty rise).

That's the professional thing to do. Accept their mistake. Admit their promised shipping deadline was nothing but wishful thinking. Ensure their customers are not losing out because of KNC's wishful thinking. Why should we lose out because they were unrealistic? After 11 days of production, they know exactly how many units they can produce a day and they already know to the day when they will ship the last units. But they refuse to update us, they keep their heads in the sand.

Look, if KNC accept they will offer compensation and come good on it, it will only make them look good. And I'm sure no one is going to start chargebacks if they are getting paid BTC for the lost mining days.

If they don't compensate their customers, they are going to look extremely bad.

Over to you KNC. Your customers, who paid you millions and gave you a business, await your response.

[Bitcoinorama]

According to yesterday's news release, 10-11-2013, they said that they have produced 700 units. So, starting from October 1st to 11th, that is 10 days. 700/10 = 70 a day at minimum.

Then we have to consider how many total units of any kind did they sell?

It must be around 4k maybe? what do you think?

It's a mega hardworking bunch of guys working as close to 24/7 as their bodies physically allow and unforeseeable issues will occur, the best resolution is to adapt fast and remain calm. Sam is still confident to hit 15th Oct. Chinese whispers and ballpark assumptions of 3,000+ orders are nowhere close, so that just generates FUD. There's actually approx a 1,000 units left. There has been over local 100 pick-ups (well 100 units picked-up), over 400 physically shipped, and a chunk dedicated to hosting.

 According to Bitcoinorama there were only 1k left  on the 9th,   and on the news letter they also said "This has been a very steep learning curve and we have adjusted the manufacturing process to be able to produce more boxes per day to try and catch up with the backlog."  so hopefully they made some major adjustments in the manufacturing process,    We will only see.

1,000 on the 9th, so 6 days from the 9th is their deadline. So, 1,000/6= ~166. They need to make at least 166 unit a day starting frmo the 9th and they were or are making, on average, only 70 a day. WTF.

More so, lets figure this out more, they had 1000 units to make on the 9th. They made 700 units by the 11th. Lets say that their original total units sold then was 1500 because that is a nice round number. That means they made 200 units in two or so days time or 100 units per day. (700 - (1500 - 1000) = 200)

That means this, they were making 70 units a day, on average, and now they are on their full operating power of 100 a day.

700 on the 11th leaves 800 left. That means 8 days from the 11th. That means they will make their deadline on the 19th unless they make 200 a day since the 11th or 2x their full capacity to make their 15th deadline.

so, they will finish their deadline by the 19th, but could they make it to the 15th or 16th or 17th?


I think i figured out their queue and shipping schedule down to the map and they didn't tell me anything.

You will get your miner shipped by the 19th for sure

but can you get it shipped by the 15th? lets see them up their production 2x


I THINK THIS IS THE FIGURES. IT MAKES SENSE, they sold 1500 units, their full production power is 100 a day.

they need to up their production at least 2x to 200 a day since the 11th, as time goes by they need to hire more workers by the 15th. Anyways, you will get your miner shipped by the 19th for sure.

Now, if they left room in the queue for 100 or 50 unit in case of contingency, then they sold 1400 units. Then they will have all their units shipped by the 18th, which is a friday.

Now what is going to happen to those people who got their units shipped after the 15th?

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

I personally should be given a Mercury because, regardless what the other guy said, I am actually THE last one in the queue and wont get my unit until the 19th. 4 days means 500 dollar a day loss because I ordered countless jupiters.



I AM REALLY GLAD THE REMAINING QUEUE WAS ONLY 1000 instead of 3000 though. Thanks

They hadn't got to the Mercuries when he said that, so how many of that 1k are only one module? If they REALLY have 30 assembly stations (trolleys with a wood jig bolted on lol) they can easily do it ...depending on staff and working weekends.

I can't see it happening, I haven't believed much they have said for a while now. As for Bitcoinorama, I don't blame him for lying low, he can't do much about it and only takes flak for stuff he has no hand in. His posts were personal before, useful observations, not they have to toe th company line..big difference.

KnC have been appauling as far as communication is concerned unless they had something to crow about. Silence in general and "Wait and see" in reply to questions from customers from support.

The deal was rigs by 15th. Written large. I don't care if they were swimming in sweat all week and haven't changed their underpants or any of that sad rubbish...that's a result of their own bragging about what they can do and their inability to plan and carry it out. It doesn't impress me one bit that they made themselves a mountain to climb. If they kept us in the picture, which would cost a couple of minutes to do...things would be different.

One smallish courier van in the photos collecting units every day...that speaks volumes. I was expecting larger capacity trucks more often. That schedule alone means rigs sitting around for a day waiting for collection. You don't send a van if you're expecting 100s of large boxes...they won't fit.

Timmers, you can spread as much BS and FUD as you like, but don't you dare call me a liar. Ignored.

Also for the record you don't call courier services and state I would like a smallish van that just about fits everything and they guesstimate it. Think about it, really. They arrange a pick up time, approximately mid afternoon and arrived in a transit one day after a small lorry the day before. If they need more they bring another van. An alternative courier service is being looked into, but at the end of the day UPS or whoever else is used, now often outsource to local third party courier services on the ground at each end, whilst dealing with the cargo and customs element themselves at the connecting airports, so even if a different courier service is used, you're still likely to have the same people handling the goods physically at initial pick-up and finally delivery, on the ground, either end.

[jmevz]

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

Speak for yourself, don't even put that lame idea in their head.

The data centre people got BTC, we want BTC.

We are losing BTC = compensation in BTC.

They claim on their website the Jupiter is 550GH/s machine, so at that speed, can current mine 1.5BTC per day.

I think 1.5BTC per day late is fair compensation, (until the next difficulty change and that figure can be adjusted).

You promised delivery of ALL units by the 15th - twice (-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=309391 ) - so put your money BTC where your mouth is KNC.

BTC compensation is fine with me too.

It's in their best interests to do this.

Otherwise, come 15th October, the chargeback storm is gonna hit them. It could destroy their credit line. And their ability to take credit card payments may be revoked.

They need to give us an update and accept to compensate customers who are going to have their unit shipped late at 1.5BTC/day (recalculated at next difficulty rise).

That's the professional thing to do. Accept their mistake. Admit their promised shipping deadline was nothing but wishful thinking. Ensure their customers are not losing out because of KNC's wishful thinking. Why should we lose out because they were unrealistic? After 11 days of production, they know exactly how many units they can produce a day and they already know to the day when they will ship the last units. But they refuse to update us, they keep their heads in the sand.

Look, if KNC accept they will offer compensation and come good on it, it will only make them look good. And I'm sure no one is going to start chargebacks if they are getting paid BTC for the lost mining days.

If they don't compensate their customers, they are going to look extremely bad.

Over to you KNC. Your customers, who paid you millions and gave you a business, await your response.

An update every two days from here on in would suffice me, I expect one tomorrow since their last on the 11th. I have a feeling my August Mercury won't hit "In Progress" by the 15th, but all fingers crossed they're onto it!

[Sitarow]

I propose for each order to be sent after 15/10/2013 KnC Miner giving one unit of 100GH / s for free.

What happens if you have 3 day one orders that are in the #300 range and have yet to receive a tracking number for them?

[jmevz]

I propose for each order to be sent after 15/10/2013 KnC Miner giving one unit of 100GH / s for free.

What happens if you have 3 day one orders that are in the #300 range and have yet to receive a tracking number for them?

You shed a tear and hope for some real compensation? Sorry to hear mate...

[sbfree]

According to yesterday's news release, 10-11-2013, they said that they have produced 700 units. So, starting from October 1st to 11th, that is 10 days. 700/10 = 70 a day at minimum.

Then we have to consider how many total units of any kind did they sell?

It must be around 4k maybe? what do you think?

It's a mega hardworking bunch of guys working as close to 24/7 as their bodies physically allow and unforeseeable issues will occur, the best resolution is to adapt fast and remain calm. Sam is still confident to hit 15th Oct. Chinese whispers and ballpark assumptions of 3,000+ orders are nowhere close, so that just generates FUD. There's actually approx a 1,000 units left. There has been over local 100 pick-ups (well 100 units picked-up), over 400 physically shipped, and a chunk dedicated to hosting.

 According to Bitcoinorama there were only 1k left  on the 9th,   and on the news letter they also said "This has been a very steep learning curve and we have adjusted the manufacturing process to be able to produce more boxes per day to try and catch up with the backlog."  so hopefully they made some major adjustments in the manufacturing process,    We will only see.

1,000 on the 9th, so 6 days from the 9th is their deadline. So, 1,000/6= ~166. They need to make at least 166 unit a day starting frmo the 9th and they were or are making, on average, only 70 a day. WTF.

More so, lets figure this out more, they had 1000 units to make on the 9th. They made 700 units by the 11th. Lets say that their original total units sold then was 1500 because that is a nice round number. That means they made 200 units in two or so days time or 100 units per day. (700 - (1500 - 1000) = 200)

That means this, they were making 70 units a day, on average, and now they are on their full operating power of 100 a day.

700 on the 11th leaves 800 left. That means 8 days from the 11th. That means they will make their deadline on the 19th unless they make 200 a day since the 11th or 2x their full capacity to make their 15th deadline.

so, they will finish their deadline by the 19th, but could they make it to the 15th or 16th or 17th?


I think i figured out their queue and shipping schedule down to the map and they didn't tell me anything.

You will get your miner shipped by the 19th for sure

but can you get it shipped by the 15th? lets see them up their production 2x


I THINK THIS IS THE FIGURES. IT MAKES SENSE, they sold 1500 units, their full production power is 100 a day.

they need to up their production at least 2x to 200 a day since the 11th, as time goes by they need to hire more workers by the 15th. Anyways, you will get your miner shipped by the 19th for sure.

Now, if they left room in the queue for 100 or 50 unit in case of contingency, then they sold 1400 units. Then they will have all their units shipped by the 18th, which is a friday.

Now what is going to happen to those people who got their units shipped after the 15th?

I think we should be given a 10% discount code or something. We can start the petition here and now.

I personally should be given a Mercury because, regardless what the other guy said, I am actually THE last one in the queue and wont get my unit until the 19th. 4 days means 500 dollar a day loss because I ordered countless jupiters.



I AM REALLY GLAD THE REMAINING QUEUE WAS ONLY 1000 instead of 3000 though. Thanks

They hadn't got to the Mercuries when he said that, so how many of that 1k are only one module? If they REALLY have 30 assembly stations (trolleys with a wood jig bolted on lol) they can easily do it ...depending on staff and working weekends.

I can't see it happening, I haven't believed much they have said for a while now. As for Bitcoinorama, I don't blame him for lying low, he can't do much about it and only takes flak for stuff he has no hand in. His posts were personal before, useful observations, not they have to toe th company line..big difference.

KnC have been appauling as far as communication is concerned unless they had something to crow about. Silence in general and "Wait and see" in reply to questions from customers from support.

The deal was rigs by 15th. Written large. I don't care if they were swimming in sweat all week and haven't changed their underpants or any of that sad rubbish...that's a result of their own bragging about what they can do and their inability to plan and carry it out. It doesn't impress me one bit that they made themselves a mountain to climb. If they kept us in the picture, which would cost a couple of minutes to do...things would be different.

One smallish courier van in the photos collecting units every day...that speaks volumes. I was expecting larger capacity trucks more often. That schedule alone means rigs sitting around for a day waiting for collection. You don't send a van if you're expecting 100s of large boxes...they won't fit.

Timmers, you can spread as much BS and FUD as you like, but don't you dare call me a liar. Ignored.

Also for the record you don't call courier services and state I would like a smallish van that just about fits everything and they guesstimate it. Think about it, really. They arrange a pick up time, approximately mid afternoon and arrived in a transit one day after a small lorry the day before. If they need more they bring another van. An alternative courier service is being looked into, but at the end of the day UPS or whoever else is used, now often outsource to local third party courier services on the ground at each end, whilst dealing with the cargo and customs element themselves at the connecting airports, so even if a different courier service is used, you're still likely to have the same people handling the goods physically at initial pick-up and finally delivery, on the ground either end.

BITCOINORAMA, i don't think he meant you were lying, i think he meant you have been staying quiet (laying low, lying low)...but since your are still on the forum.....

[sbfree]

BITCOINORAMA, since it seems you are the UNOFFICIAL KNC rep, and I think some of us here on the forum also find you are OUR UNOFFICIAL rep as well....

from reading the posts here, it seems alot of us are disheartened at the state of things. Most are appreciative of the feat the has been accomplished and are glad to be a part of this event. All of KNC customers have invested their BTC/money under certain terms of conditions, both verbal and written. Yes we all understand this is a 'prototype' machine and that 'Murphy's Law' does exist as well. Unfortunately, KNC's somewhat lack of communication, change of terms and time delays with no explanation has created disenchantment with the whole process.
As time ticks by, some of us are watching our reasons for having invested in KNC go by BLOCK BY BLOCK, and this even has only been fruitful for the select few who ordered early.

Although KNC ultimately holds all the cards, we the customers hold KNC's reputation. At some point, KNC should understand our frustrations and consider us as investors in their endeavor, and as such, if KNC can compensate some of us who are losing this race against time without sacrificing KNC's ability to survive as a company.

Clearly late Day 1 or Day 2 orders should have some sort of compensation, and those that paid subsequently might be compensated thereafter up to a certain date that corresponds to Oct 15 sales/ Nov sales. Meaning if you purchased OCT/NOV delivery dates and receive product on time or very shortly thereafter are not included. But if you paid in say June/early July, these orders most likely expected delivery dates shortly after Day 1 and Day 2.

I for one ordered June 18th and paid that day. Lets say it took a week to process my order. I still placed and paid my order in JUNE expecting "end of summer", then "end of September" delivery for DAY 1/2, so 1 figured I week and no more than 10 days after that I should be mining.  In my eyes, I consider my order 3 days late and counting.

I for one would be ok with hashing power that can be pro rated based on days late vs. difficulty change, or even something where we spend more money/btc, but get compensated as well....that way KNC still makes sales...something that works for all....fair for the early early investors/miners who are currently mining, something that works for those early investors (early/mid June- Mid July??) that are NOT MINING RIGHT NOW but paid the same and have waited just about the same as those DAy1/DAY2 that are mining....

anyhow BITCOINORAMA, it seems that you are THE VOICE....

[Bitcoinorama]

Sorry Timmers, I re-read that. I was making something to eat at the time. I only the lying and the low were cut off between a subsequent line of text.

[timmmers]

LMAO. 

It's rubbing off, ignoring customers 

[soapmodem]

To say that I'm angry would be a gargantuan understatement at this point.

I have 1500 GHashes on order from KnC, both in personal orders and group buys. At the current difficulty that means I'm losing about $550 per day. That's a lot of money, regardless of your station in life.

The cry for compensation isn't a hopeful one in my book, it's compulsory. There's absolutely no chance I'll order from KnC again if some form of compensation to preorder/October customers isn't worked out, end of story. I think most if not all of us will feel the same way.

[Sitarow]

I propose for each order to be sent after 15/10/2013 KnC Miner giving one unit of 100GH / s for free.

What happens if you have 3 day one orders that are in the #300 range and have yet to receive a tracking number for them?

You shed a tear and hope for some real compensation? Sorry to hear mate...

Nah no worries. Got some mates together and we made personal orders totaling 10 Jupiter units before they started taking payments.

Once they started taking payments. Any large orders had to be split up into individual pieces if you wished to take advantage of paypal.

I paid BTC. The other gents had to split up their orders. By that time within 24 hours the order queue was in the #1500+.

However they did have orders in the #300 range. Sam in an email had stated within that 7 day window that it would be combined.

I can only guess at the cause for the delay. Perhaps the notes used by the queue coordinator was not updated for those orders. And because of that it was pushed back in the queue.

It became apparent to one of my colleagues the reality that ROI in BTC would not be achieved,

You can guess what happens next, and you know KnCs new policy with respects refunds.

As you may have guessed rather then investing in hardware. You may have better success investing in companies that handle BTC transactions along with payment processes in btc.

I am a optimist by nature. The fact that I like to help out when I can does not help the matter.

Needless to say I am now the owner of that order.

In fairness to KnCs team efforts in attempting to deliver all orders on time, and the fact that unlike others who I have ordered from in the past. Who shall remain nameless.

I may yet get close to the amount of btc I had paid for back from the units.

Edit: In case your wondering, When those orders were placed the KnC reseller/distributor incentive program was not in place. So I do not expect that the program would extend back to day 1 pre-orders.

Edit2: Disclosure: I also felt it necessary to state that I have not signed up and have not taken part in the KnC reseller/distributor program.

[arlekyn13]

What annoys me about KnC is not really the fact that most likely my units will be shipped past Oct 15th but rather their attitude about refunding orders that are late past that date. Somehow, putting a void clause into their terms and condition make them think they are right, that they can be late and maybe, through some sort of great mercy, they might compensate us, the customers. Well, it's wrong. They MUST either refund or compensate customers for late delivery, and more than that, the customer must agree with the proposed compensation if not previously agreed.
Conclusion: KnC - wrong attitude

[sbfree]

 

LMAO. 

It's rubbing off, ignoring customers 

[sbfree]

BITCOINORAMA, since it seems you are the UNOFFICIAL KNC rep, and I think some of us here on the forum also find you are OUR UNOFFICIAL rep as well....

from reading the posts here, it seems alot of us are disheartened at the state of things. Most are appreciative of the feat the has been accomplished and are glad to be a part of this event. All of KNC customers have invested their BTC/money under certain terms of conditions, both verbal and written. Yes we all understand this is a 'prototype' machine and that 'Murphy's Law' does exist as well. Unfortunately, KNC's somewhat lack of communication, change of terms and time delays with no explanation has created disenchantment with the whole process.
As time ticks by, some of us are watching our reasons for having invested in KNC go by BLOCK BY BLOCK, and this event has only been fruitful for the select few who ordered early.

Although KNC ultimately holds all the cards, we the customers hold KNC's reputation. At some point, KNC should understand our frustrations and consider us as investors in their endeavor, and as such, KNC should compensate some of us who are losing this race against time without sacrificing KNC's ability to survive as a company.

Clearly late Day 1 or Day 2 orders should have some sort of compensation, and those that paid subsequently might be compensated thereafter up to a certain date that corresponds to Oct 15 sales/ Nov sales. Meaning if you purchased OCT/NOV delivery dates and receive product on time or very shortly thereafter are not included. But if you paid in say June/early July, these orders most likely expected delivery dates shortly after Day 1 and Day 2.

I for one ordered June 18th and paid that day. Lets say it took a week to process my order. I still placed and paid my order in JUNE expecting "end of summer", then "end of September" delivery for DAY 1/2, so 1 figured I week and no more than 10 days after that I should be mining.  In my eyes, I consider my order 3 days late and counting.

I for one would be ok with hashing power that can be pro rated based on days late vs. difficulty change, or even something where we spend more money/btc, but get compensated as well....that way KNC still makes sales...something that works for all....fair for the early early investors/miners who are currently mining, something that works for those early investors (early/mid June- Mid July??) that are NOT MINING RIGHT NOW but paid the same and have waited just about the same as those DAy1/DAY2 that are mining....

anyhow BITCOINORAMA, it seems that you are THE VOICE....

[Biffa]

BITCOINORAMA, since it seems you are the UNOFFICIAL KNC rep, and I think some of us here on the forum also find you are OUR UNOFFICIAL rep as well....

<snip>

anyhow BITCOINORAMA, it seems that you are THE VOICE....

If you are going to repost that every 30 minutes I may have to ignore you :p

[sbfree]

BITCOINORAMA, since it seems you are the UNOFFICIAL KNC rep, and I think some of us here on the forum also find you are OUR UNOFFICIAL rep as well....

<snip>

anyhow BITCOINORAMA, it seems that you are THE VOICE....

If you are going to repost that every 30 minutes I may have to ignore you :p

sorry biffa, won't happen again.....

[Its About Sharing]

If this is just a firmware issue, then KNC probably were running the lines anyway. So, I don't understand why they would be so far behind. They should have completed (or nearly completed) units ready for firmware installation.

The main question I now have is, perhaps this wasn't just a firmware issue. And if they identified it as a firmware in only the last few days or in the last week, then they still could have been (or are) running the assembly line.