I'd like to remind everyone that refunds are not completely out of the question.
BA said they would tally up the refund requests and see if they have enough money to give the refunds from the margins. (10million usd already spent on tapeout)
I am pretty sure if you send them a few emails and bitch enough you can get a refund. Worst case you end up having to sell your order to one of the many willing to buy it.
If I remember rightly BA was going to go ahead with tapeout with or without customer cash. So using that as justification is disingenuous. Reality is if people ask for a refund it should be PROVIDED full stop. They are no different than BFL or Avalon if they start playing the we will see when we see game on refunds. That is not how to instill trust and likely will entrench the mindset that it is time to sue them to get refunds if push comes to shove. Given what I know of the people involved I hope they take the 100% refund route if people ask without prefacing it with but tapeout cost millions etc. no company can afford to piss off the community at this juncture especially BA pushing the delay as long as they did. |
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I didn't know anything about the other firms, I knew that BFL would deliver, even if it was late. I was more willing to shell out 20k on a sure thing than risk getting scammed by people I hadn't dealt with before. I'm a big fan of antminer S1 at the moment, dirt cheap, and they arrive right after you order them.
That is a fair enough assessment except not everyone got their units from BFL it was not most assured that you would and given that some people waited in excess of 12 months you are dreaming, still more are owed a refund and some customers are having to go to court to get compensation. At this point BFL is no better than any "unknown" scams of the past, present and future. You do know that the Monarch is now 10 months into "pre-production" based on the statements from BFL? |
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All I know was that my Jallys were 6 months late.
To me, whatever they claim, re-claim, counter-claim, fabricate and re-adjust has absolutely no credibility whatsoever.
By the time they ship, 600 Mh/s won't get you 0.05 BTC per day, if you're lucky.
You're better off buying whatever hardware you can get your hands on now for $2k, than waiting 3-6 months (if you're lucky) for a Monarch.
If you've pre-ordered, you screwed yourself, and have nobody else to blame.
Meanwhile millions are being absconded from this community by BFL. Why don't you focus on the real and immediate threats caused by BFL? Still no answer. Just a diatribe and more avoidance. And as soon as Josh misses one weekly payment, I'll be back in BFL's threads like... like... like... Still thinking! LOL... he didn't PAY his bet. He is doing WEEKLY to shut you up. Nice. Oh my what a joke. Paid off silence. That just puts a nail in your credibility coffin right there buddy. No wonder we haven't had the DETAILS. Does anyone else think that stinks to high heaven? Being paid weekly to keep your mouth shut more like. Done dealing with this thread your payment arrangements with Josh speak volumes on what is really going on. That is an ignore till you stop taking a dive for coins. |
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Which is worse?
BFL or Black Arrow?
Josh Z. or Matt C.?
Seriously.
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Care to respond to WHY you are not posting in BFL threads considering they are doing a lot more DAMAGE to the Bitcoin economy than Black Arrow at this point?
How does Matt's warehouse / hosting have anything to do with Black Arrow shipping units? Canard much?
Would you not just get on teamspeak, gtalk or some other medium and get the answers and then report back here? I don't see anything here that is menacing for a Black Arrow customers. Again really what is the point? Other than to muckrake and sensationalize this well out of proportion. I suggest you would get a LOT more answers if you just started a voice chat and had an open dialogue with Matt. At this point you are really just trying to be the center of attention and not really resolving anything for anyone. Take the ego down an notch or a 100 notches get the answers you need from him directly and POST it here. I can't watch this obvious ego centered attack on Matt or others without doing the simple thing sitting down with the people and getting answers you need. Unless you are doing this for other reasons.
How is Matt's record on shipping units and hosting? Is that not more RELEVANT a measure? I do believe there should be 100's of customers at this point that can attest to his trustworthiness. Again really there is evidence to support Matt as a person that has been trusted, has delivered so why exactly are we concerned with warehouse space? Is he not providing a service? Are those services being denied customers?
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All I know was that my Jallys were 6 months late.
To me, whatever they claim, re-claim, counter-claim, fabricate and re-adjust has absolutely no credibility whatsoever.
By the time they ship, 600 Mh/s won't get you 0.05 BTC per day, if you're lucky.
You're better off buying whatever hardware you can get your hands on now for $2k, than waiting 3-6 months (if you're lucky) for a Monarch.
If you've pre-ordered, you screwed yourself, and have nobody else to blame.
Meanwhile millions are being absconded from this community by BFL. Why don't you focus on the real and immediate threats caused by BFL? Still no answer. Just a diatribe and more avoidance. |
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Taken literally, the title implies that a great fuss ("much ado") is made of something which is insignificant ("nothing"), such as the unfounded claims of Hero's infidelity and the unfounded claims that Benedick and Beatrice are in love with one another.  Or if you prefer.  So no REASON for yet for your taking up this distraction versus actually saving people from BFL. Sad so much for TRUTH. |
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Better use of your time... attack BFL and help bring them down.
Black Arrow is responsive.
Black Arrow has regrettably delayed shipping.
Black Arrow is not perfect.
I don't see any relevance to getting miners faster with this line of inquiry. They messed up they are trying to fix it chalk this up to another company with a set back nothing more. Our own group would have LOVED to have some Minion chips to play with and are somewhat sad we won't see the chips the end of this month. I don't see where this thread is going? Please STATE CLEARLY what you are driving at here. What is it exactly you are trying to get the community to understand? If there was a FOCUS then I might actually pay attention to what you are doing. As far as I can tell you have posted names of people great most of the people in this community already know who the BA players are.
The actors associated with Black Arrow are NOT being up-and-up with their investomers at best, with them conducting something rather nefariously, alone or in concert, at worst. For instance, as I continue to read threads on this forum, and elsewhere, I've recently learnt that I wasn't the first person to raise a concern about Matt Carson moving his datacenter at least twice, to date. At the moment, I'm not considering you a fanboi of Black Arrow, but reserve the right to change my position on a satoshi. ~TMI BTCITW Where is there evidence to support this? Up and up? Define where they have not been up and up and how that is somehow intentional and further how that caused a loss for the customers? Again Bobsag3 (Matt) answered your questions. He told you straight up when asked why he moved datacenters. How does his datacenter affect Black Arrow shipping? At this point there is nothing more than lack of communication and I don't see where anyone is trying to purposefully hide facts from those who pre-ordered Black Arrow products. Your time would be BEST spent on a company that has lied outright to the community. PG you can go FUCK yourself and your opinion about whether I am a fanboi for BLACK ARROW. I don't care about your opinion about my love or hate of Black Arrow products and the people associated with them. I am not a fan of people who basically side step their own TRUTH. You are such a person. That is what is circumspect in my mind about you and this new found focus on Black Arrow. Let me now play the J'ACCUSE GAME with you. Why are you not posting about BFL anymore? Be HONEST. Don't side step and dance about come out and tell us why? Why should anyone trust someone that doesn't come straight out with it? Can I speculate that you are now on Black Arrow and others as being paid off by BFL to do so? I reserve the right to call you a shill of BFL since you fail to comment about them further and they continue to rip off the community. Still waiting on the TX ID for all your donations as well. Still not posted with links to forums where you have indicated donations. See it is pretty easy to make threads that call people into question. I am pretty sure you put donations in and are an upstanding member of the community. But you are seriously misguided in this respect with Black Arrow or are you just trolling to get another free meal and a miner shipped? |
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Better use of your time... attack BFL and help bring them down.
Black Arrow is responsive.
Black Arrow has regrettably delayed shipping.
Black Arrow is not perfect.
I don't see any relevance to getting miners faster with this line of inquiry. They messed up they are trying to fix it chalk this up to another company with a set back nothing more. Our own group would have LOVED to have some Minion chips to play with and are somewhat sad we won't see the chips the end of this month. I don't see where this thread is going? Please STATE CLEARLY what you are driving at here. What is it exactly you are trying to get the community to understand? If there was a FOCUS then I might actually pay attention to what you are doing. As far as I can tell you have posted names of people great most of the people in this community already know who the BA players are.
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As soon as we have working units and they are fabricated by you or other fabricators, then you can license those units with us. Just follow what Beastly said and he will keep you updated. Please pm me your email address to be included on the list. Information going out to people soon.
Thanks
p.s. i will updated everyone with our social networking accounts soon. We can also be contacted on them. Thanks
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First of many lawsuits that will bury BFL hopefully.
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Wasp
Rather than being a Wasp update this will read as a product review of Cadence software... long story short !@#$%^&*( shit is a nightmare and we are so deep into building up component libraries we don't have the time or resources to simply switch out. Our EE has, yet again, had to fight tooth and nail with the latest version of Allegro(OrCad) just to get a things back to where he started as the software seems to like to revert things back even after resolving specific problems in the design. So in an effort to cut out time we dropped a row off the design to make placement of traces easier and increased the length of the board nearly 2.5 cm. This has again delayed the bring up PCB board. We are trying a number of steps to see if we can port the design out with minimal issues to another software but via another EE while the original EE continues working on the existing software. At this point we are certain after getting done with Wasp Hive for the A1 / BitFury we will move to a new software.
Hive
The Hive will have modifications continuing in an effort to support the changes in the Wasp. The design should be ready in the coming week and we are looking at the fabrication cost of this unique design and should have an estimate coming in on this soon for this Beta version of the Hive.
Firmware & Software
Further tests have moved on manually feeding blocks to the emulator and it has been successful. EE's will work on two 'flavors' of the firmware.
Website
Currently the website is being tweaked for color and logos. A share exchange system is also being started this week.
Mining Pool
Back End & Front End Coding for the pool and it is still going through security and full testing. We are working on the DGM and possibly PPNLS if we are not happy with the DGM configuration after we live mining next week.
PR & Marketing
PR and Marketing is starting to add social media sites and to contact our fabrication partners or those interested. Please PM Beastlymac if you want to get on our newsletter / mailing list of fabricators. We want to keep you in the loop as we get close to testing the Wasp. We want to make sure that fabricators can start their fab as soon as possible after we have put out working designs.
License Fee
We are still refining pricing at this time taking into account the various types of chips and their pricing structures will figure into our fee pricing.
Provisioning Server
We are nearly done on the work for the server just waiting on the Wasp completion.
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Thanks to Pinkfloyd11, Lucko and VS3 for sitting in on the meeting on Saturday. We all hope we were good hosts and you were able to get the information you needed from the meeting.
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He is a paid agent for BFL. Simple as that. Same techniques employed by any number of BFL types posting here.
1. Misdirect & Lie
2. Ignore Factual Information
3. Attack the Person
BFL is going to have a day of reckoning and then these paid shills will simply disappear.
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If it can be proven that BFL knew their timelines were unachievable, then they knowingly participated in a deception. Ergo, fraud. And there's the rub. Proving that they knowingly participated in a deception is fairly difficult. Hanlon's Razor states: Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. On the face of it, the simplest explanation is plain incompetence. To make it to the level of fraud, you're going to need some proof. Note that I'm not actually saying that BFL are (or are not) fraudsters. Just pointing out that the legal threshold for calling it "fraud" is just a wee bit above the allegations thrown around by the armchair lawyers here. There's a whole lot of armchair everything around here. On that note, if in discovery it was found that BFL had been given dates from suppliers that don't align with BFL's public communication made at the time I don't imagine it'd be that hard to draw the connection. As an aside, designing and manufacturing an ASIC is quite a bit more complicated than most of the armchair hardware designers would have you believe as well. I write software for a living, but I do it in a hardware world. It's pretty fucking difficult to ship a commercial hardware project out the door, let alone one that involves custom silicon.
 Tell me about it. Especially for BFL. How are those Monarchs 10 months and counting. |
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Le Bumpage for those that missed this.
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He lacks the intestinal and ethical fortitude to tell the truth. I suspect like you said he has been paid to obfuscate what are clear facts about how BFL operates. Everyone should simply ignore him as he has been unwilling to accept basic facts about BFL and rarely adds anything relevant to the discussion anyhow. Need to focus people on the merits of suing BFL. Once the precedent is set BFL will likely need to declare bankruptcy so that Josh and others at the top can walk off with proceeds. No one who has watched what BFL is doing in any depth believes BFL is an honest broker in the BitCoin world. I suspect most customers will never buy again and that is telling.
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Hello I have sent a PM but still not have received reply from you. My email is gpezzella@yahoo.comThanks I sent you my email. Please contact me via email. |
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PinkFloyd11 please send me an email with a short profile. I will see what I can do to get you in the meeting tomorrow and see what we need moving forward on the Project. We are in need of Firmware work as we are looking to add a number of features over the coming months. In terms of hardware we might have a number of new chips to work on to develop into Wasps so another EE or two might be very much what we need moving forward but we can discuss that on Saturday.
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How about we focus on BFL?
What BFL is doing is nothing more than selling equity and passing it off as a product. 12 months does not a pre-order make. It is fraudulent plain and simple to say you are going to deliver product in October when you know full well your product won't ship for at least another 3 to 4 months and possibly more. We all have seen them do it and this lawsuit puts a fine point on it. Let us look at the Monarch... started design over 10 months ago according to their own statements. Same play every time put up "optimistic" date and then wow go figure they fail to meet the deadline and push and push and push 12 months later still people have yet to receive their miners. Same pattern again and again. This is clearly fraud and if you say different you are obviously paid by BFL in some fashion. Shills for me get ignored I have not time to argue with anyone who is paid to promote this company when we all understand without reservation, based on evidence right here in these forums, that BFL is morally and ethically bankrupt. Let us hope in the future we can just drop the adverbs.
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There are literally 100's of similar incidents of late, failed delivery, no refunds, poor RMA etc and the tip of the ice berg given how pervasive these issues are across the planet. It really begs the question how inept are BFL?
There are more complaints posted and threads started about BFL in the widest range of social media that any other fabricator. Partially do to the volume of orders but mostly due to the ineptitude on so many levels at BFL.
Let us all hope that this is not the last time BFL goes to court. Let us also hope that these lawsuits finally put an end to BFL. Their model for bait and switch and delay shipping is being shown to be a scam based on competition being able to design, sell and ship in cycles in the same time it takes BFL to push a single design out in what is always a 12 month design to product window. 10 months now on the Monarch.
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